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Old 6th September 2010, 14:13   #1
pete693
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Tannoy enclosures

When I purchased my Tannoy DU386 speakers sometime in the late seventies they came with a Technical Manual and Enclosure Guide for the DU386,DU316 and DU296 speakers.The enclosures shown are the Arden,Berkeley,Cheviot,Devon and Eaton. It goes on to say "All are ported to provide low-frequency loading,although the ports may be omitted and a totally sealed cabinet constructed if the tighter,infinite baffle sound
is preferred.Any other forms of enclosures,such as horn-loaded types and labyrinths are not recommended."
It's the last sentence which I'm curious about since it seems to me that some very highly regarded enclosures fall within these types.
Anyone have any thoughts on this?
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Old 6th September 2010, 17:27   #2
cooky1257
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The technical manual that accompanies the 3828./DU386 kits can be downloaded under 'Tannoy technical and modification information' labelled "tech manual model K3828 in zip format"here;
http://www.hilberink.nl/speaker.htm#cabinet
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Old 7th September 2010, 20:16   #3
pete693
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Tannoy enclosures

Bit surprised I must admit.
I thought that someone might have had an explanation.
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Old 7th September 2010, 21:37   #4
la toilette
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I have no idea why Tannoy make this assertion but then I'm not very technically aware on such things.

Take a look for some recent threads on here about Speedy Steve's diy GRF cabs as he initially used 3828's and was clearly very happy with them, compared to Berekely cabs IIRC.

Also could try asking on the Yahoo Tannoy forum; lots of knowledge there and maybe someone can shed light on the thinking behind Tannoy's recommendations.
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/tannoy/
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Old 7th September 2010, 23:04   #5
cooky1257
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Probably nothing more than Tannoy not wishing to get into answering tons of design queries over the phone.
In the link provided for the pro kits they don't mention horns at all.
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Old 9th September 2010, 10:05   #6
speedy.steve
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Probably not recommended cos they could not build them at a price to attract enough custom to make it a viable business in that market segment.
Wanted to sell complete boxes rather than drivers to a few DIY'ers to make GRF's...
Berkeley / Arden's are pretty cheaply made (materials) and have limitations in sound that the GRF for example, soars over.
The backloaded practise continues today with really very similar drivers - go figure...

My first task with the 3828's was to get Mr Coco to model them on a horn simulator compared to his Golds for the GRF horn.
Pretty similar and near enough to give the project the green light.

Having put HPDs and Golds in the same cabs and listened a lot the sound is slightly different and you kind of get where Tannoy were going with the change of music styles and need for more power. Orchestral and jazz to Led Zep for example.
That said the difference Gold to HPD to 3828 in exactly the same cabs is not that huge. All have that big Tannoy sound. The Golds excel on Jazz and emotion. The 3828's get up and boogie in another way and seem to handle more complex music better whereas the Gold could get irritating. Cone bracing spiders perhaps is my guess.

Putting CPA12s in GRF's clearly worked well - see other threads about those...

So to summarize, I think Tannoy were clearly steering horn customers to their prestige ranges.

Last edited by speedy.steve : 9th September 2010 at 10:27.
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Old 9th September 2010, 11:11   #7
pete693
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Tannoy enclosures

I think that you have hit the nail on the head regarding steering customers on to the more expensive Tannoy enclosures.
On the subject of Berkeley cabinets I agree that in their supplied form they do leave something to be desired. I removed the factory lagging from mine,put another layer of panel damping over that which was already installed,removed the port tubes and sealed the front panel holes flush by filling with plastic padding.I lagged the inside with 38mm acoustic foam with as many layers as I could fit without crushing and filled all remaining spaces with loosely rolled B.A.F. wadding. I removed the recessed terminals from the back of the cabinet and replaced them with some nice meaty ones that I spaced slightly further apart and much easier to connect to.I also replaced the internal wiring between the crossover and the terminals. Earlier I had bi-wired the crossovers but in all honesty I could detect no difference having done this so put them back to original form.
I should point out that all of the above was not done in one hit but was arrived at over a fairly long period of time a bit at a time and seeing what difference it made. The changes above are the final verdict and I am now very happy to leave them alone.
I have not mentioned all my failures on the way.I try to forget them.
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Old 9th September 2010, 11:38   #8
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quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by pete693 View Post
I think that you have hit the nail on the head regarding steering customers on to the more expensive Tannoy enclosures.
On the subject of Berkeley cabinets I agree that in their supplied form they do leave something to be desired. I removed the factory lagging from mine,put another layer of panel damping over that which was already installed,removed the port tubes and sealed the front panel holes flush by filling with plastic padding.I lagged the inside with 38mm acoustic foam with as many layers as I could fit without crushing and filled all remaining spaces with loosely rolled B.A.F. wadding. I removed the recessed terminals from the back of the cabinet and replaced them with some nice meaty ones that I spaced slightly further apart and much easier to connect to.I also replaced the internal wiring between the crossover and the terminals. Earlier I had bi-wired the crossovers but in all honesty I could detect no difference having done this so put them back to original form.
I should point out that all of the above was not done in one hit but was arrived at over a fairly long period of time a bit at a time and seeing what difference it made. The changes above are the final verdict and I am now very happy to leave them alone.
I have not mentioned all my failures on the way.I try to forget them.
apart from lockwood , there is a great book that will enlighten all TANNOY lovers like me, and it specyfies enclosures for different size ILS AND DC 385'S , the book is:
the TANNOY STORY BY JULIAN ALDERTON, super,
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Old 9th September 2010, 12:25   #9
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At the time these kits were available Tannoy was a very different company.
You could ring them up and talk directly to Alex Garner, they'd pop some connectors or bolts or what have you in the post foc.
They'd give quite lengthy advice on diy versions of their studio monitors/kits.
What they wouldn't do is get into your own experiments/designs/plans and would often default to the 'we wouldn't recommend that.." to avoid any liability.
They are still generally quite helpful eg but are pretty mean with T&S figures for example-even on discontinued units..
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Old 9th September 2010, 16:28   #10
nando
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unit's are still available not directly from tannoy, but lot's of other sources, i still have a spare cheviots 12" and berkley''s dc 385's but they need re-coning, i never got on with red mon's
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Old 9th September 2010, 20:21   #11
pete693
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Tannoy enclosures

Quote:
Originally Posted by nando View Post
unit's are still available not directly from tannoy, but lot's of other sources, i still have a spare cheviots 12" and berkley''s dc 385's but they need re-coning, i never got on with red mon's
On the subject of re-coning,this site cost me a fair bit of money last year ( I am glad to say).
I was reading on here about someone having their Tannoys re-coned because the surrounds had gone sticky and deteriorated. Well I knew that mine were O.K. but decided to have a look anyway.My finger stuck to the rubber and distorted the surround when I took my finger off.
A call to Tannoy who recommended Roger at Lockwood and I was on my way.
The result really amazed me.Because the deterioration is so slow I had no idea that they were so far off song.
If anyone is in any doubt about re-coning and their speakers are getting on a bit in years then they should go for it and be really grateful for a new lease of superb life.
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Old 10th September 2010, 18:51   #12
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Agree, but Lockwood re-cone because it is cost effective for you and them to have new cones. There may actually be nothing wrong with the cones - it's just the surrounds that need doing. Cost comparison is ~£30 for a genuine surround kit (all you need to refurb) and ~£400 for a recone by Lockwood. I am not knocking Lockwoods at all, they do a great service but if you are half handy a refoam is perfect. See my refoam...

http://www.hifiwigwam.com/showthread...oject-write-up.

My surrounds were exactly as you describe...

Now good as new.

/Steve


Quote:
Originally Posted by pete693 View Post
On the subject of re-coning,this site cost me a fair bit of money last year ( I am glad to say).
I was reading on here about someone having their Tannoys re-coned because the surrounds had gone sticky and deteriorated. Well I knew that mine were O.K. but decided to have a look anyway.My finger stuck to the rubber and distorted the surround when I took my finger off.
A call to Tannoy who recommended Roger at Lockwood and I was on my way.
The result really amazed me.Because the deterioration is so slow I had no idea that they were so far off song.
If anyone is in any doubt about re-coning and their speakers are getting on a bit in years then they should go for it and be really grateful for a new lease of superb life.
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Old 10th September 2010, 23:44   #13
la toilette
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IIRC it's only Speakerbits in Oz who claim to supply "genuine" Tannoy surround kits (and allegedly Tannoy and definitely Lockwood don't acknowledge them as such), and when I last bought some about 5 years ago they were a little over £100 for a pair of 12" drivers, compared to approx £300 for a full recone (at the time). You can buy pattern replacements more cheaply from elsewhere however, but they vary in quality from what I've read.

I was very happy with my diy jobs, but if I'd been flush I would still have sent them to Lockwood.
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